[Red_Negan]

Feel free to move this post to a different section if needed but I just want to share my thoughts on this topic that seems to be asked over and over again.

Firstly I just want to say thank you for your in depth reviews, many other reviewers may do a good job with numbers and measurements which they focus on, you actually give an overall picture of how a display looks which being an AV guy originally, really appreciate more than just numbers so just want to say thank you for your hard work.

Now my post today is really hopefully to lead to a discussion or simply just an excuse to finally post something on here haha. Before getting into design involving monitors I was in AV and AV sales. Coming from that field IPS type displays always had pretty weak performance even with better processing and processing for Full Array there were inherent limitations. When I started using monitor for design purposes and gaming (for gaming it took a long time to finally ditch my Quantum Dot VA panel haha, it was too big when I started taking competitive gaming seriously) I always knew that IPS displays were favoured due to their gamma consistency, viewing angles were important although I always preferred working on VA although for some or most I can see why having better viewing angles for piece of mind that everything is consistent is important. I always felt IPS type displays due to their lack of sealing leading to low contrast and light leakage caused problems form giving me an overall picture of your work, a lack of dynamic range in a sense. For wide gamut work, monitors weren’t really utilised in the same way that IPS type displays were also so options were limited for professionals in that sense.

Recently I had the AW2721D and Samsung G7 at the same time. I felt the pros and cons from the panels inherently were at play. Due to the lack of good image processing on monitors, the strong contrast performance of the 27″ G7 overcame the AW2721D for most things, movies, atmospheric games. I tried Resident Evil The Village and that game commands a strong contrast to which the G7 displayed greatly. The AW2721D really fell flat in this game. Where the AW2721D shines is due to the screen surface (an area I really appreciate your reviews is you factor in screen surface which makes a bigger difference than many think) light shades have a very smooth appearance so light sources look smooth. Games like Red Dead 2 look good on the AW27 but the G7 has that cohesive glue in that light sources appearing with more dynamics is more convincing on the G7 which is where VA type displays have that big advantage.

I’ve always felt that IPS type displays are on borrowed time because when wide viewing filters come over to monitors for VA, IPS will lose it’s advantage unless there’s something specific such as gamut coverage. Where the monitor world is slow or a niche market, I don’t think this come any time soon though so it could easily stay the same situation. I do feel that with the improvements in VA motion, the G7 in measurements seems only beaten in speed in one aspect (G2G) by the Omen X and is arguably the fastest monitor, at least 1440p monitor on the market today which is amazing considering this has been VA’s black cloud for years. The AW2721D does feel less snappy than the G7 albeit slightly smoother due to the Gsync module but I do feel this could be expectation bias. I do feel that while the AW2721D has some strong traits like Screen Coating, decent semi HDR performance, the G7 feels like a more substantial monitor. I’ve heard reports of the 32″ being quite disappointing but I cannot confirm that, I’ve only used the 27″ versions. When the flat panel comes out it will prob draw those in who don’t want to give curved a shot or simply don’t like them. I adapted to the 1000R curve pretty easily and actually think it’s more a strength than a niche but YMMV here. I would like to see prober sRGB modes, dE’s less than 2 out of the box in future from Samsung, possibly go a tad smoother on screen surface and more dimming zones for a more involving semi HDR experience.

When it comes to 240hz displays I’ve them all minus the Acer 270hz AUO panel and the upcoming PG27 which looks to have a good sRGB and wide gamut switch which is fantastic. I feel right now for raw performance and picture quality, the G7 has the versatility to be the choice although I know viewing angles are valued by some for work purposes. I do see the G7 as a true multimedia, gaming displays; in other words it’s a display for play.

Back to VA and IPS in general, it’s a funny thing because the AV community in general dislikes or finds IPS weak while the monitor community have in their heads that IPS are the better performing LCD’s. Now I can understand why because VA have been under utilized in monitors where IPS were pushed as professional grade monitors but It’s interesting because despite there being plenty of data of VA performances in TV’s, where they’ve have more focus much of the monitor community, mainly reddit and other places seem to not be aware of the strengths of VA panels and they’ve even been compared to being on the same level as TN type displays. I’ve actually made many comments regarding this in the past on hose places but sadly to only be met of the whole, IPS= Best because that’s what marketing and information they’ve been told. I’m a big fan of VA type displays and I hope that moving forward, we get good examples to do them justice.

[PCM2]

Hi Red_Negan and welcome,

That’s an excellent first post. Your name is familiar from Reddit discussions, which I peruse from time to time but don’t participate in myself. I have seen you spread the ‘good word’ about our reviews there as well and I very much appreciate that. I think this post is welcome to stand on its own as it’s a very specific comparison and one which many users will have in mind. Although I didn’t get around to testing it out myself and have now found myself inundated with other models, I have certainly been happy to ‘conditionally’ recommend the 27″ Samsung Odyssey G7. Because it does away with the key complaint many users have with VA technology by offering very competent pixel responsiveness. Whilst there are some weaknesses, they’re as minor as they come on a VA model and only affect transitions involving very dark shades. Even then, they’re not slow enough to provide ‘smeary’ trailing. So they’re easy for most users to ignore or simply not notice in the first place.

I’ve made some points relevant to the Odyssey G7 (both positive and negative) in this thread, which you may have already come across. I’ll reference your post there as well. The colour and gamma consistency compared to the IPS alternatives remains a key weakness, there are saturation losses from a normal viewing position as a result. They aren’t extreme and when coupled with the fairly generous colour gamut I suspect most would consider the output ‘vibrant’. But some will subjectively prefer IPS models even when gaming, for this reason. On the other hand, I’d point to a certain situational vibrancy with VA models like the G7, so to speak. A good example might be where bright or perhaps neon shades are set against a much darker background. Bright glowing orange flames with a dark background, perhaps. The combination of the colour gamut plus stronger contrast compared to IPS models gives a definite ‘pop’ there. Likely the same sort of thing were referring to in your post with reference to light sources appearing more realistic. 🙂

I’m not familiar with ‘wide viewing filters’ and I’m not aware of any monitor panels in the pipeline that would use this, but I assume this is with reference to VA panels with much improved colour consistency and viewing angle performance? That would indeed be a nice thing to see on the monitor side if that’s what you were referring to. I will also mention here that the recommendations section is currently undergoing a major revamp. It will be expanded and split into specific uses including gaming. I intend to properly feature the 27″ Odyssey G7 as a key gaming monitor recommendation. Others have certainly echoed your positive sentiments around the monitor and regardless of whether I’ve reviewed the monitor myself I think it’s right to put it there as a key model to consider.

[Red_Negan]

No worries at all. yeah I tend to recommend your reviews and your site in general. While some other sites are good like Rtings for measurements or Hardware Unboxed which have stepped things up with their HDR testing, none of those sites really give a look into how a display actually looks which you guys do. Rtings measurements offer clues where you kinder have to put the pieces together with their colour bleed test results, anti glare test (I find their numbers act in reverse, the more mediocre the result the clearer the screen in many cases). It still doesn’t offer the same level of depth as you guys do. Reddit are very much consumed with the numbers which you guys offer too but you also offer like I said an idea of what to expect looking at the display which I value a lot.

Yeah wide viewing filters sadly are not in monitors which is weird because VA weakness is more highlighted in monitors due to viewing distance. Hopefully at some point! Yeah I do understand those preferring IPS type displays for consistency. I’m for sure more partial to AHVA panels with their improved sealing and dark uniformity but it appears that those types of displays seem to now offer contrast more similar to traditional IPS displays, the new Asus HU reviewed seemed quite weak in this regard at around 900:1 which isn’t too far off what most expect from LG IPS panels. The Acer 270hz that Rtings measured seems more typical of what I’ve seen from AHVA at the near 1300:1 mark but I’ve have noticed that many seem to be getting lower than what they used to. The FI27Q-X that you reviewed has some good strengths, near full gamut coverage of all colour spaces. I did feel that the lack of local dimming really hurt the overall package, it has the sensibilities for a good semi HDR experience, light matte, gamut etc.

The upcoming G7 flat display is something I’m also interested in but I did feel the 1000R offered a unique experience albeit not the most universally accepted for those used to flat panels but a cool experience for those that like it. I do feel that would’ve been a good time for Samsung to offer their wide viewing filter being a flat VA and a chance to make it more of a one stop shop rather than a pure entertainment monitor.

[sayhejcu]

I think IPS panels made a big buzz when everyone were using TN monitors back in the day. Some kind of hearsay, myth made these IPS monitors holy grail in the eyes of gamers/pc users. I hope manufacturers will lean on VA models more but i don’t see it happening any time soon. Even roadmaps are filled with overpriced IPS monitors.

Even simple things like desktop wallpapers looks bad on IPS. I had to lower gamma quite a bit to be able to see properly with my IPS monitor. IPS looks like sunlight hitting my screen and i’m struggling to see what is going on on the screen even in a dim room. Color consistency is cool though. Also those nano ips colors pop nicely. What i noticed on 32 inch G7 is that they use pretty high gamma settings which makes things look more contrasty and popping. Once you calibrate it, it doesn’t actually pop that much except red which is a bit odd on Samsungs. I feel like nano ips have more even wide gamut saturation while Samsung’s quantum dot have especially saturated reds mostly in the center blob of the screen.

So far VA response times and viewing angles are acceptable enough but IPS contrast and glow not acceptable enough for me so i can understand your choice. Also G7 motion performance is truly amazing. It’s a joy to watch ufotest with it while it’s headache inducing with most monitors. 240hz + amazing response times looks like you have enabled the backlight strobing. I hope flat G7 fixes scanline issues at 240hz.

[Red_Negan]

I do think for now IPS displays do have a place but like I said in the original post I feel they’re on borrowed time. I share your view for the most part especially when it comes to certain content looking bad. I’ve owned two G7‘s I had one from the first batch and felt it had an oversaturated look with high gamma, certain dark shades of grey looked too dark. I actually stuck my colorimeter on that one and ended up with sub 3.0 average for dE which as surprising as it looked quite poppy. Contrast was sub 3000:1 ish on standard settings, but it did vary, on average from memory it was about 2400:1 on FPS mode and the gamma was around 2.3 I think. This G7 I currently own I’ve not thrown a measurement tool on it as I stand firm in not getting too obsessed with numbers and want work and play to be separate but I found it less oversaturated than my AW2721D and from memory a lot more tame compared to my previous G7 although some shades of red are still redder than they should be but skin tones are tamed.

The speed and motion clarity on these VA panels is pretty remarkable, for sure a step up over all the other 240hz In-Plane switching type monitors I’ve tried and feels about on par with the Omen X27. There was a lot to like on the AW2721D the smooth screen surface really gave the image a clean look and the oversaturated colours made some scenes look enjoyable if one likes that look but the native contrast was poor, shadows looked pale, lost depth and playing games like RE Village to name a recent title really highlighted the weaknesses of these panels for me.

I have been interested in the XB273U GX, it’s been sitting in my basket, will prob sale out soon but I’ve always been a fan of AHVA panels, I feel they’re superior to tradition IPS panels in some areas especially sealing giving better dark uniformity and the potential for a bit stronger contrast although nowhere near the 2400:1 the G7’s tend to be. To be honest while it sounds a good monitor, the G7 offers a lot of pros such as motion clarity, speed, contrast, unique design that makes it hard to really go back to a standard display.

[PCM2]

I’d be careful about using the term “borrowed time” in the monitor market. People have been saying the same thing about LCD technology for several years now in relation to newer players such as OLED. 😉 I’d also question how much more innovation we’ll see for VA panels in the monitor market owing to the fact the main manufacturer (Samsung) is winding down their own LCD panel production. In fact I’m worried the upcoming flat Odyssey models might be based on CSOT rather than Samsung panels and will be lacking the same level of responsiveness as the curved G7s. We’ll have to see and I sincerely hope not given that many have said they’d love the G7s if not for the strong curve! Which I agree people should actually see for themselves in person before judging. I hope to see AUO really push to fill the gap with strong VA innovation. There’s definitely demand for it and as manufacturers increasingly turn to them for VA technology that should spur some improvements.

I should also add that I’ve received feedback with respect to the 27″ Odyssey G7 (C27G75T) compared to the AW2721D reflecting different thoughts about responsiveness. That they found the IPS model a bit faster overall. If you look at the numbers or appropriate pursuit photographs the G7 is actually the faster monitor for most transitions. The AW2721D has slight ‘powdery’ trailing for some transitions where the G7 would have none. The exception would be for very dark shades where the G7 has weaknesses the AW2721D does not. But these are confined to a small selection of transitions and less extreme than on other VA models. I suppose it might depend on the content you view and I wouldn’t discount other perceptive factors at play. This user was also sensitive to ‘static interlace pattern’ artifacts, which are an issue with the Samsung at very high refresh rates such as 240Hz. Only a minority would notice and they’re far from extreme on the 27″ model (they’re more of a ‘feature’ on the 31.5″ version).

[uncia]

Some things are subjective. I have tried a good number of monitors, from flat 27 and 32-inch models, to curved types of the same sizes. I’ve also tried LG’s Nano IPS ultrawide. I liked the 32-inch Acer, but it had a green slant to the colors I didn’t find appealing. The contrast was better than the Nano-IPS panels from LG. There seemed to be slightly less backlight bleed and negligible IPS glow, but it was definitely there. I posted my thoughts at the time I had the monitor, somewhere on the forum here (mod edit: this post). My favorite monitor overall was the LG 34GP83A. VA panels have more of their own type of glow and worse backlight bleed, so the improved contrast on paper often didn’t come across with the models I tried.

I’m actually interested in the ASUS TUF Gaming VG34VQL1B right now. Users are noting better viewing angles than most VA monitors. It also has far better specified, and recorded, contrast than a lot of modern VA panels. The color gamut is on par with what most have at 90% DCI-P3. The brightness tops out over 500 nits. It’s also supposed to have good pixel responsiveness. Some users note issues with certain colors trailing instead of powdery, smearing trailing, or is it overshoot? I forget. A lot of people don’t notice or have this issue. Asus seems to be responding to a lot of complains and will possibly put out a firmware update to try to alleviate this as best they can. There may be an inherent weakness to the new panel that can’t be overcome. There are always compromises. Considering it costs $500 USD vs. the LG at $800 USD, for what reviewers are saying is fairly comparable performance, it might be worth giving a chance. That really depends on whether someone wants the tradeoffs of a VA monitor. Viewing angles and color shift remain issues. They may be improved, but Adam has reminded me it’s just a trait of VA down to the physics of the design. There may or may not be a gamma adjustment option in the OSD. So that’s also something worth considering. If calibrated, it evidently does very well as far as registered color consistency and accuracy.

I’m still watching user reviews and seeing how it pans out in the long run. The 1500R curve is less aggressive than the 1000R at least. I wish they’d go back to 1900R for my liking, but that doesn’t seem to be the trend here.

[PCM2]

I’m still seeking feedback on the VG34VQL1B as well, it’s a very interesting model. Some feedback was shared in this thread and I’ve received some more by email. Based on the feedback I’ve received it does seem to have overshoot issues, but ASUS may be able to alleviate some of that by re-tuning things. It seems the panel it uses has good potential, with less obvious and widespread weaknesses than most VA UltraWides. As it stands at the moment and based on this feedback, I’d say it’s definitely one people should try out if they’re interested in what it has to offer. It really plays to the main VA strength of contrast, with respectable colour reproduction and without widespread ‘smeary’ trailing. I’d recommend it for general purpose usage and movie watching. I’m a bit split on the gaming side of things for the moment, but subjectively speaking it could work nicely there for some.

[Red_Negan]

That’s true although I’ve felt the cry out for OLED are those thinking it’s going to be the saviour. Don’t get me wrong I enjoy what OLED offers, I use them for work and my personally owned TV’s are OLED with some Quantum Dot VA TV’s too. I see where the appeal comes from, having per pixel illumination certainly gives those light sources in dark scenes hyper focus and an experience there that LCD cannot compete with for SDR and even for HDR at least when it comes to the domain of contrast, dark uniformity and depth. A lot of complaints about LCD seem to be things like uniformity in whites, greys but OLED also suffers from those, grey banding, boxing, white uniformity, the aspect of calibration I’ve always found OLED’s to need it more often too. A good LCD TV for example can be better than an OLED in many key areas but not so much when it comes to the dark levels. I do personally want to see more from LCD tech in monitors before OLED stops being a bigger niche in a niche so to speak. A lot of people also seem to think that pixel refreshing is going to help with burn in, it doesn’t, pixel wear is pixel wear. PR are meant to actually help with temp retention and can occasionally help with stuck pixels, it seems a lot of the reasons people want OLED are based on misconceptions, at least from what I’ve seen in certain places. I’m prob in the minority for sure for preferring more advancement in LCD monitors but I feel simple things like lighter finishes on displays, better Full Array dimming, better calibration (G7‘s are calibrated but seem to be tested in P3 which explains why they seem spot on in HDR mode).

I think that VA tech in TV’s has reached a level that IPS type panels can’t compete but the plus side of TV’s is being able to take that next step with image processing. For monitors, it I think that VA has more to offer going forward in terms of potential but the question is will they? slowly is prob the realistic way as our hobby is a very small market in terms of tech, time will tell I guess, when we’re all retired on our pension maybe we’ll discuss how cool it is to finally have wide viewing angle filters on our VA monitors.

I agree about the G7 being cleaner in motion test, I find it actually to be quite a big difference, the AW2721D I felt had the edge in smoothness but I do feel this could’ve been expectation bias as it’s really splitting hairs but the G7 feels snappier when I used both. The G7 feels like a fast TN panel, it’s certainly an odd monitor and it holds it’s performance all the way down the refresh range where as most other 240hz monitors start to flop a bit in comparison. The 27″ which I have here does show some interlacing often on a lot of sites I go on, I can’t say it bothers me too much but I could certainly do without it. In stress test, lagom and the Asus wallpapers are pretty well known for making it play up. I’ve noticed it a bit in ARK Survival Evolved on my characters back and certain rocks, minor but it’s there.

[PCM2]

Some feedback has just been posted by a user of the forum which I think is worth linking here. Just a few quick thoughts on the FI27Q-X and how it compares with the Odyssey G7 in their view. Highlights once again just how subjective this all is.

[Pronably]

Recently my Samsung Q90T 55″ died on me while playing Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla. Long story short Samsung is going to refund me my money because there is not a repair guy within 100 miles of me nor does any warehouse close me to house it. I actually ordered it off Amazon because the TV selection in Southern Oregon is horrible.

So a couple days ago I was doing some research on gaming monitors. I own a RTX 3080 while it does 4K gaming beautifully… the FPS gains you get for dropping into 1440p can be around 15-20 FPS. So I decided I was going to go 1440p as my native resolution for my gaming monitor.

I really wanted to make sure I was getting the right one. One thing I noticed on this AOC Limited Edition G2490VXS 24″ (which was actually used as my stream chat monitor) is that the colors jumped out a bit more than my actual TV.

I’m 100% a noob at all of this and made sure I did some research. And there is where a big thank you comes to this website and the feedback in this thread.

I ended up purchasing the AW2721D. And this was between that, the FI27Q-X and the Odyssey G7. That day I learned the difference between IPS, VA and TN and a bunch of other things.

So in the end… all 3 of the monitors I wanted it came down to what the recommendation was on the website. Thank you guys for the input 🙂

[PCM2]

You’re very welcome. And how are you finding the Alienware?

[Pronably]

I will be receiving it Wednesday. Once I do I will definitely give my thoughts on it.

Although the FI27Q-X has some advantages screenwise… one thing I loved about the AW2721D is that it does have a ton of USB ports. One can never have too many USB ports haha. This will be my first time owning Alienware-anything, too. I build my own PCs so I will never own a prebuilt by them but I know Dell doesn’t mess around when it comes to screens.

[Red_Negan]

That sucks about the Q90T. It’s a very good TV and offers a lot of traits that surpass many many popular TV’s like the B9, BX and even the CX. An interesting choice from a Q90 to the AW2721D. You’ll def notice a different world when it comes to text clarity, finer gradients, textures in certain games, monitors have a significant edge when it comes to some of those areas especially when it comes to text clarity, often colour accuracy at least when it comes to out of the box calibration.

The AW2721D has some of the best light source smoothness I’ve seen for a monitor, certain video games that have lamps, sunlight’s beaming through trees, the AW is excellent at this. Obviously the Q90T is a different world when it comes to picture processing, contrast and HDR performance being a VA TV with a Quantum Processor but it’s also a different product altogether at this point so while I do believe TV’s and monitors can be compared in some respects and there’s a lot to take from the TV world into the monitor world, I feel in some key areas they’re just too different for it to be fair.

While I don’t regret selling my AW, it was a nice monitor, the design feels solid, it looks good especially if you have a set up with white it blends nicely and I love the customizable options when it comes to lights. Bezels are tiny which I’m a massive fan of. I thought it had actually quite good semi HDR experience, I don’t buy into the whole anything less than HDR1000 is rubbish, that’s a load of elitist hyperbole.

[Pronably]

So this is my impression of the AW2721D.

I don’t think I have ever seen picture clarity like this before. The colors just scream out at me haha. I am in total love! I do miss the Q90T but it just made sense to use a gaming monitor for gaming. Now I have enough room on my desk for the AW2721D and my AOC Limited Edition 24″.

Also I want to make mention that I own a RTX 3080 so that was another deciding factor on why I went with the AW2721D for the G-Sync module.

I decided to run it in 12 bpc @ 144 hz instead of 10 bpc @ 240 hz. I don’t play any online competitive FPS games really so I don’t need the extra hz. But something I have noticed is some slight screen tearing on Mass Effect Legendary Edition. Would it be better to throw this into 10 bpc @ 240 hz? How much color loss and I going to notice? Also you guys are all amazing. You should make a Discord for this website. I’d definitely be around to chat in there.

[PCM2]

Glad you’re enjoying the monitor!

Notice we’ve just published a gaming monitor guide (feel free to share this with others). It’s not as detailed or focused as our usual articles, but that’s by design. 10-bit colour is only mentioned in the context of HDR and it mentions that SDR content is limited to 8-bit colour. So there’s no advantage whatsoever to using a higher bit depth than that when gaming, although it won’t hurt to leave that enabled either. You should be able to see for yourself (or more to the point, not see for yourself) the difference between them and conclude from that it doesn’t matter what you set it to. The monitor and GPU will as good as shut off any processing above 8-bit for SDR and 10-bit for HDR. And if you select 12-bit it just allows GPU dithering on top of what the monitor is doing, which is only going to be used to any real effect for 12-bit content. Which you aren’t creating or consuming.

I appreciate the thought about Discord, but I don’t really have time to do something like that. And it wouldn’t be healthy for me to spend my downtime chatting about my work, essentially. 😉

[Pronably]

So then it probably wouldn’t hurt to drop down to 10 bpc. I’m going to check out that guide straight away! I’m glad there is somewhere on the internet I can come and chat about my monitor. Really happy to have it. It makes Mass Effect Legendary Edition look REALLY good!

[Red_Negan]

Bear in mind the AW2721D is really an 8-bit monitor not a native 10-bit so running at 10-bit 240hz is a limited range.

Playing games with text will make it look worse. As mentioned if you’re not running HDR and have no intention to or even if HDR is only 10% of your use case for example you’re best leavening it at 8-bit 240hz full range.

In my honest opinion you might as well use these features as intended otherwise you would’ve been better off just getting something like the M27Q or any other 144hz monitor and saving a hell of a lot of money haha. Monitor don’t really have better image processing as you go up in price they rely on screen coatings, calibration, motion clarity and more importantly contrast so having limited settings makes less sense.

That’s good you’re enjoying it, the AW has solid picture clarity with its smooth screen surface which makes it really shine in light room gaming. If you ever do try HDR on it it’s one of the better monitors out there right now that is less than HDR1000.

[PCM2]

I assumed (perhaps incorrectly) that Pronably was referring to selecting 10-bit or 12-bit with an HDR signal on the Alienware. At 240Hz 10-bit would be Full Range RGB with 8-bit monitor side + 2-bit GPU dithering. Which works very well, I wouldn’t hesitate to use that. Under SDR at 240Hz you’re absolutely right, you’d only be able to select 8-bit at 240Hz whilst maintaining the optimal Full Range RGB signal. For most users it’s usually best to simply keep the Nvidia default status “Use default colour settings”, which will use 10-bit as appropriate under HDR and 8-bit as appropriate for SDR gaming. With a Full Range RGB signal in both cases.

[Pronably]

This is basically my monitor usage.

95% gaming (with HDR whenever possible)
5% other (which is Youtube when I eat or something.)

Quite a few games I play (the Assassin’s Creed RPG trilogy and Mass Effect Legendary Edition) use HDR. But it is true I am not always playing games with HDR either. Also I realized I cannot set my nvidia display settings to 10 bpc @ 240 hz.

[Author]

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