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NorthernChrisI was going for the Benq, I delayed it because of not being able to find any reviews and going by the brand name but literally last second I’m finding this review of the 24 inch model, and I don’t like it:
…Its contrast ratio was even worse, coming in at a measly 169:1 on its default settings, and a mere 310:1 when I whacked up its gamma option to its highest setting. That’s a far cry from BenQ’s claimed figure of 1000:1,…
…This isn’t helped, of course, by the GW2480’s astronomically high black level measurement, which came in at a massive 1.28cd/m2….
Of course the Benq is the 24 inch one and probably has a different panel but unless the reviewer messed up those look like terrible contrast numbers.
PCM2Yes, the reviewer did mess up. It is what happens when you don’t correct the colour signal. Read so-called reviews like that and you end up less informed then when you started, unfortunately.
NorthernChrisSo any idea if these new Philips monitors with “Ultra Wide-Color” promising wide gamut coverage are worth it ?
93 NTSC is a little too high for a cheap monitor, is this some new panel technology or something like fake HDR ?NTSC 93%* and sRGB 124%*
Philips 276E9QJABNTSC 108%*, sRGB 129%*
Philips 246E9QJABPCM2There is no reason a monitor has to be expensive to achieve a wide colour gamut these days. Enhanced phosphors on backlights are an inexpensive solution as used here by Philips. And seen to good effect in models like the BenQ EW277HDR. You can forget proper HDR capability unless a monitor has many dimming zones, but the colour gamut is nothing to do with that. And of course the full-fat HDR experience comes at a price far beyond this. If you admire vibrant colours then by all means go for something like this,. or consider the BenQ EW as I don’t really think ‘IPS’ is a stringent requirement for you?
NorthernChrisSo, the Benq i ordered last week was in sort supply and has been delayed…
PCM2, don’t you think the “ultra wide colour” these philips monitors are promising to be a real factor ? I mean philips is the only brand promising such colours for such price so I’m a little surprised they are not more popular.
Am I going to see a tangible difference between the Benq’s 72% NTSC and philips’ -alleged- 104% or am I over thinking it ? I do have the contrast on my current TN monitor very low for anything non movie related if that helps.
About the BenQ EW277HDR you proposed above it looks really good, but I do want to go for an IPS panel.https://www.philips.com.hk/en/c-p/276E7QDAB_69/lcd-monitor-with-ultra-wide-color/overview
PCM2As I’ve said, enhanced phosphors on backlight don’t need to be expensive. But not everyone likes such heavily saturated colours (oversaturated for sRGB content) so manufacturers don’t always deem it appropriate to use them even if they could. There are certainly some cheaper models that use a bit of extension (for example the BenQ GC2870H) or some that offer a similar gamut to the Philips but use a higher resolution panel. And are still cheap for the size and resolution. Such as the AOC U3277PWQU and others that use the same panel. Yes, you’ll see a clear difference between that sort of colour gamut and a narrower gamut, have a read of the linked content!
Or if you want a better comparison between the sRGB colour space handled accurately and a much wider colour gamut refer to the colour reproduction section of our ASUS PG27UQ review. Also note the observations under HDR. That means the colour gamut is used properly rather than everything being universally oversaturated. I feel I was a bit heavy-handed with my description of the strong saturation in my AOC U3277PWQU review, I know from user feedback that many people prefer that look and it’s something of an expectation given what people are growing used to from TVs and even smartphones these days.
NorthernChrisAbsolute thanks for great help by the way.
So, I did get the Benq after like 2 weeks of waiting, and build quality wise it’s really good, the stand is fairly steady, pixel density wise 1080p at 27 inches is really fine, no dead pixels, minimal BLB on one corner, minimal glow and the eye care stuff was marketing bs but you already know that.
And after some 10 years with couple of TN monitors i can say that: MY EYES BURN !!! Seriously, the colours are great, the contrast is great but the bright whites are just unbearable. I love how the games and movies show on the screen but anything desktop related with white backgrounds is just killing me. I got the brightness to like 10% and I still felt immense relief hooking back my Samsung TN.
PCM2Welcome to the wonderful world of viewing comfort issues. And everybody’s eyes being different. I’m sorry to hear that you’re not getting on with the BenQ, although you should really try to get used to it if you can. Give it some more time, which I know is easier said than done if it’s causing obvious discomfort. It is going to take some adjustment coming from your old monitor(s) which are very different and use extremely different backlights.
The ‘Eye Care’ stuff is anything but marketing bs, at least the LBL settings aren’t – they make sense in context. But they aren’t going to help you if you have spectral sensitivity to the backlight. Aside from lowering brightness, what other settings have you played with? How close are you sitting to the screen and how is your room lighting? Also – have you corrected the colour signal as advised in the review?
NorthernChris>I’m sorry to hear that you’re not getting on with the BenQ
Well here’s the problem, since this IPS failed for me I don’t know what kinda monitor I could work with because I do need another monitor right now and I got an IPS with the prime reason of visual comfort and it’s a disaster.
I thought it was fine until I put them next to each other. Reading pdfs and working on excel etc is simply terrible on the IPS !
Left:BenQ BL2780 (brightness 60, construst, 40, 65k color temp, sRGB setting)
RIght: Samsung SA350 (brightness 82, contrast 32, 65k color temp)
https://i.imgur.com/XwieAB3.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ieKaEH9.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ONYEiVz.jpgThe whites are both terrible and a LOT more of a burden to my eyes. The TN in comparison is reading heaven !
I am at a loss. Do I go for a VA or maybe for an IPS 4k or another TN !?>Also – have you corrected the colour signal as advised in the review?
This is for HDMI input right ? I tried both D-Sub and HDMI inputs and did the 59hz trick but saw nothing different.PCM2Sorry, you should’ve been more specific about which BenQ you meant. Because I thought you were referring to the EW277HDR. The BL2780 uses a very basic WLED backlight and I have no idea how it performs nor how to set it up as I haven’t tested it. I wouldn’t be turned off IPS-type panels necessarily because of your experience with the BL2780. You may well find the more balanced spectrum of the Philips models you mentioned a lot more enjoyable. I would strongly advise reading the viewing comfort article I’ve linked to several times now. 🙂
NorthernChris>I wouldn’t be turned off IPS-type panels necessarily because of your experience with the BL2780
I know I shouldn’t be but honestly it’s hard not to be ! Apart from the famous “viewing angles” part that is synonymous with IPS, the monitor is both too yellowish and the brightness/luminance just hurts my eyes. This is so disappointing. I mean as long as I look at my TN straight on the colours, and the whites are just massively superior. I don’t even understand this thing about IPS colours being “great”. I try to push myself to use the monitor for at least an hour but it’s just a pain. Physically. I try to lean further back because it’s 27 inch but it’s still so tiresome to use.
I read your article and right now I’m watching the 43 minute video. I don’t know if it’s the Temporal dithering or some sub-optimal subpixel structure but this IPS cannot display the colour white ! I took the brightness all the way down to 25, the gamma at its lowest (although I can’t notice any difference with the gamma either way), the contrast to 35 and red 95 green 95 blue to 100 trying to get rid of this godawful yellow but it’s still bad. If anything I have a new founded respect for my Samsung.
Some youtube comparison I should have watched before buying, the IPS simply looks worse than the TN.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFkLVNAYw70PCM2It will be to do with colour balance and backlight difference. Nothing whatsoever to do with the panel type. And there is also a fair chance your S24A350 is too cool in its tone, with a high white point. You are used to that, an uncalibrated screen. I don’t doubt the BenQ is still too warm with what appears an uncorectable green or yellow tint, it looks like it has a urine filter in some of those videos and pictures even when viewed in isolation. Although if you’re comparing to an uncalibrated reference it doesn’t really help – and your Samsung viewed in isolation on your photos looks far too cool. It can be very difficult to tell from images, though, especially with both monitors in the same photo and the camera balancing things.
NorthernChrisI know the photos are just a very rough guide to what I’m trying to say and not all that accurate.
I got the BenQ’s red, blue, green down to 55,55,60 then upped the brightness and contrast if that’s what you mean by cool. It does help with that painful brightness but then the monitor becomes way duller than the Samsung in terms of colours. And of course the white is still very disappointing. I don’t know how uncalibrated the Samsung is but it really good having a white background on MS Word.
I don’t if the low pixel density has some part in this (light is escaping between the pixels ?!) but this glowish yellowish tint is the big reason why this monitor is going back.
NorthernChrisMy final thoughts on the BenQ BL2780/GW2780; it’s horribly uncalibrated out of the box. Firstly, sRGB mode is sunset mode ! Under User mode, no matter how I tried I couldn’t get rid of the yellowish tint. Going for the cool experience with the nice whites of my TN I came up with a very dull result which is a definite step down from the TN colours. A huge disappointment considering IPS monitors are highly praised for their colours. The monitor is constantly giving me a very tiresome glow no matter how I mess around with the brightness -although that might be part of the IPS experience I’m not familiar with since I’m coming from TN panels. And finally the brightness sensor is practically useless since you cannot use it under USER mode (custom calibration mode) which is essential. I would suggest it strictly for PS4 games and movies. As a productivity monitor it was an absolute disaster working with Excel, SPSS etc. with the annoying brightness and the terrible whites.
On a positive note 1080p is perfectly acceptable for a 27 inch screen sitting usually at about a 60 cm distance.
PCM2Well at least you know the pixel density works out fine for you. So it may help you move forward and consider alternatives, with many of the more interesting models being 27″ Full HD. It does sound from everything you’ve described to be very poorly calibrated and thus a sad waste of IPS technology. 🙁
NorthernChris>very poorly calibrated and thus a sad waste of IPS technology.
Honestly I don’t really know. I simply couldn’t get acceptable whites without that yellowish tint, and I don’t think that was a calibration issue. And when I got a somewhat acceptable white with the help of my AMD radeaon settings, everything started to look blueish. And when I got the brightness down to acceptable levels the colours were terribly dull. And don’t let me get started on how BLB (only from one corner if I might add) destroyed the blacks in dark movies.
Also the viewing angle from above were bad in an odd way: I look at my monitor a lot from above because I usually put something on youtube and do some exercises (like over the head press) while standing up in front of the screen. The IPS had a terribly washed out / greyish hue from above.I know it’s bizare how bad my first experience with an IPS was.
PCM2Not all IPS models are created equal. You clearly got a poor example of one, be it due to the backlight used, calibration or a combination of factors. If the native colour temperature is way off and you need to make extreme corrections to the colour channels, you reduce contrast far too much in doing so. But you’re correct that viewing IPS models from above or below can be odd as it can give a ‘hazy’ look, at least if you’re relatively close to the screen at the same time. For the same reason ‘IPS glow’ blooms out more noticeably off-angle. TN models have attrocious gamma shifts vertically from much more gentle viewing angles and even colour inversion beyond a point. So it’s six of one half a dozen of the other.
You seem content with the TN experience, though, and there’s no shame in that. Everybody’s eyes and preferences differ and no technology is perfect. So by all means consider a TN option instead. I would say don’t rule out VA for your uses and indeed that was my original suggestion to you.
NorthernChris>TN models have attrocious gamma shifts vertically from much more gentle viewing angles and even colour inversion beyond a point.
Obviously I have a limited experience with monitors compared to a pro reviewer -I went from CRTs to TNs, but this BenQ legit made start considering if this IPS superiority thing is a bit of a meme, because yeah; the HUGE TN drawback is the viewing angles but it’s also kinda easily correctable: just sit straight ! Which in the case of a desk monitor is fairly easy. But on the other hand the risk of a yellowish tint and the IPS glow are absolute deal breakers for me. If the VA have less of a risk I will consider it. But in the case of my Samsung the cool white combined with really popping colours is th perfect thing for me.
PCM2Actually that’s the point. TN viewing angles are so poor that there are obvious saturation and gamma shifts vertically. You can sit as straight as you like, if you compare the top and bottom of the screen it looks completely different because your eyes subtend very different relative angles. As explored in relevant reviews and summarised in our panel types article. As I’ve explained, the yellowish tint is nothing whatsoever to do with the panel type. But as I’ve also mentioned, the haze you describe at sharp vertical viewing angles is an IPS weakness. So I can entirely sympathise with that plus the obvious tint issues being unsightly on the model you’ve tried.
Cheshire CatPC Monitors, please come to my rescue! 🙂 I am a gamer on a budget, I currently have i5 4460 + RX 470 and a Dell Ultrasharp 2312HM. I want to get myself a nice VA panel (I want that epic contrast) monitor that will do nice in games (I play online multiplayer FPS games, (MMO)RPG’s) and movies/shows. The budget is thin, but I would like to squeze as much as I can out of $250. I want a lot of stuff from a monitor, but I’ll try to be realistic 😀
I was looking at Benq VZ2470H, but it lacks most of the stuff I want, is it possible to fit the desired requirements below in this budget range? I can only buy locally in my country (in central/southeast europe).
* Fastest realistic responsivenes and lowest input lag for this price range
* I would LOVE to break out of 60Hz and get something that’s flicker-free with at least 24″ & 75Hz and Freesync.
* With this kind of budget, I guess I’m stuck with 1080p but I wouldn’t mind a higher resolution 🙂
*Bezels – I would love them to be as small as possible because I would probably make a dual or triple monitor setup in the future and big bezels suck 😀
*Colors – I like colors xD (I guess the colors are OK on my current Dell, I wouldn’t mind them to be at least as good or better)
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