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olivierfHi all,
I’ve been spending way too much time to look for a replacement for my very old Samsung 24″ 1080p VA and every time I think I’ve found a great monitor going through reviews online, I find some issue that makes me look again for the Perfect One.
I’m mostly doing work stuff and general browsing, photoshop and (basic) video editing.I need:
– a flat screen
– very good color reproduction in the sRGB space, i.e. small dE (I have a colorimeter so I can calibrate if out of the box is not good)
– strong contrast (I’ve been spoilt with a decade on VA with a 3000:1 contrast and I can’t go back)
– good enough uniformity
– flicker free
– very good clarity/ text readability
– ideally good tilt, height and swivel adjustment but I can mount VESA if needed
– wider gamut would be good but not a must (as long as >100% sRGB)
And I don’t need anything remotely connected to gaming.Based on these requirements, I initially focused on VA monitors but it seems there isn’t any at that size/resolution that is flat apart maybe from the Q27G2U but I read in the forum that there were problems with text when browsing the web on the curved version (not sure if the flat version has the same panel?).
On the IPS side, there is quite a few options, but even setting aside the contrast for a minute, I’m not sure where to go:
I have looked at the Asus PA278QV but I’m not convinced I will actually not notice the PWM given how sensitive my eyes are…. (not sure whether it is the same for the PA278CV). Then we have the Gigabyte M27Q (but no sure about the subpixel arrangement for readability), the BenQ SW270C (with PWM), the BenQ SW2700PT (old and difficult to find), or the VP2785-2K (old and not available in HK), the UP2716D (old and difficult to find). Or conversely the more recent but somewhat uninspiring U2721DE (for which I can have a discount through work).Are there other VA options I might have missed?
On the IPS side, which one would best match by requirements while having the highest contrasts?
And am I then better of with the VA or IPS one?Thanks for the help!
PCM2Hi olivierf,
My recommendation is very clear for this sort of usage and that’s currently the ASUS PA278QV. I’ve recommended this to plenty of users, including those who consider their eyes sensitive to brightness and flickering. And they’ve always been perfectly satisfied with it in terms of viewing comfort and indeed its colour performance. The PWM frequency is extremely high at ~20 kHz, you’re more likely to find any artificial lighting in your house (especially LED bulbs) bothersome before the monitor causes you any issues. And it did enough to be certified as flicker-free by TÜV Rheinland. RTINGS has now confirmed that the PA278CV uses the same backlight regulation method. Speaking of PWM usage, that is indeed unusual on the BenQ SW270C. Although it’s at a very high frequency. With that as an exception, BenQ has used DC dimming in all models as long as people have even considered ‘flicker free’ backlights as a concept. I note they stripped ‘flicker free’ marketing from the SW270C at some point, too.
I’ve also recommended the M27Q to plenty of users who are very happy with it for mixed usage. And it does benefit from quite generous Adobe RGB coverage if you wish to edit within that colour space as well (not perfect, but better than many models). As covered in the review the subpixel issues only bother a small minority of users – although more than would find the 20kHz PWM of the ASUS bothersome, I might add. I agree it would be nicer if the Gigabyte had an RGB subpixel layout, but I’ve gathered more than enough data on this model to say with confidence that it’s only a small number of users who would find the issues bothersome. I don’t see either issue as a suitable reason to avoid giving either model a try. For the sake of an issue that’s unlikely to cause you any problems. And if it does then fair enough – return the monitor and go for something else.
You clearly value colour accuracy as it’s important for your work, so you certainly should consider IPS-type panels above VA panels. For reasons of colour consistency, made clear in our reviews and summarised in our panel types article. You say you read that the AOC CQ27G2(U) has some issues with text when browsing the web, but I think you must be referring to comments I made regarding some weaknesses with pixel responsiveness rather than static text clarity. Because the monitor doesn’t have any particular issues that should cause issues for text clarity, motion aside. And those motion issues apply equally to pretty much any VA panel at high refresh rate. Where there are pixel responses that are simply too slow for the rigorous demands of such refresh rates. The Samsung Odyssey G7 (C27G75T and related models) is the exception as highlighted in this thread. There’s discussion about the CQ27G2(U), its flat counterpart and alternatives in this thread.
browncI too have the same question as OP. And I’ve been through 7 monitors already searching for an answer! I saw a question where the benQ representative states that they don’t care about eye care in the SW270C because they want to have the most perfect colors. I was all set on buying the BenQ SW270C but then I found a review through google translate with proof that it has PWM for brightness control. So now I’m sad because I don’t know what monitor to buy……!
What I want is this:
–27″ monitor with 2560×1440 resolution, the 25″ in this resolution was just too small
–great text clarity as I work with spreadsheets and small text a lot
–full color gamut not just sRGB, after seeing it you won’t want to go back to just sRGB
–I would prefer a flat VA panel like my older monitor, but they hardly make any of those anymore
–won’t buy innolux, too much sparkly harshness on my eyesHere are the monitors I’ve tried so far:
— Asus PA248QV monitor : great price, accurate colors, same size and resolution as my old VA monitor. Only to find out that it’s high frequency PWM just destroyed my eyes and caused lots of strain. I wasn’t sure why when I first got it, but the dimmer I made the brightness the more my eyes hurt. I finally did research and found this series of monitors has high frequency PWM which perfectly explains why my eye strain got worse turning down the brightness. Everyone’s eyes are different and mine surely did not like this monitor. Doesn’t matter if it’s high frequency, while your mind can’t process the brightness in that short of intervals, it doesn’t mean your eyes aren’t getting strained.
— Viewsonic VP2768a : was very excited as I thought this would be the one. It has the LG panel LM270WQ4, which is shared with the BenQ PD2705Q and Lenovo P27h-20 monitors. Didn’t love the buttons for OSD, those were crappy but now it seems all monitors are that way. I do think the joystick OSD control is the way forward. Color was accurate, but limited to sRGB. I thought that would be fine, until later. What I disliked about it was the far sides right and left got darker about 1.5″ in from the edge. Moving my body sideways to be in front only helped about 50% at most. here was still a darker edge on the sides, and horizontal viewing angle wasn’t the issue. It seemed like a line in the monitor it wasn’t gradual. Very little eye strain with this panel. But I thought maybe I could find better.
–ViewSonic XG2705-2K : a gaming monitor with higher refresh rates, hoping that would help my eyes. It did make a tiny bit of improvement the higher refresh rates, but nothing worthwhile. It also required a thunderbolt docking station, or thunderbolt direct cable only, since usb-c can only do 2k res at > 60 Hz if the rest of the downstream data is limited to usb 2.0 only. Hence my usb-c docking station had usb3.0 ports on it so it wouldn’t do more than 60 Hz. Took a while to figure that all out. This monitor was much better on the edges, just slight variance in horizontal viewing that went away moving my head sideways and was hardly noticeable. It didn’t have the 1.5″ dark areas like the VP2768a. But the color wasn’t as good and while I messed with a lot of settings, it simply wasn’t going to get very good without a better tool for color correcting. There was some eye strain, more than the vp2768a but it wasn’t horrible.
–Dell 2521D : wanted to try the smaller size which had great text clarity. nice panel, it was only slightly off in color but close enough. It too was only sRGB. But the size had me leaning forward sometimes. And there was some eye strain, just a little more than the XG2705-2K.
–Lenovo L27q-30 : great price and 75 Hz so I wanted to try it. There’s almost no reviews on this range of mid-grade business monitors. It’s horizontal viewing angles were amazing, better than any monitor I’ve tried. Color was slightly off but I was able to manually get it set pretty close to the Dell 2521D and even happier with colors on it even if it wasn’t as wide a gamut as I now desire. eye strain was ok but not as easy as the VP2768a monitor, so I wanted to try more. The 75 Hz with an hdmi cable left some cyan sparkles which went away with either 60 Hz or a DP cable at 75 Hz.
— Lenovo p27h-20 : same panel as the VP2768a, and easy on my eyes. Text was super sharp which proves this is a great panel if you are okay with sRGB. By default it has a reddish tint, and neutral color mode was a tad too blue. I think many monitors are moving to reduce blue light so they are factory set for reddish color. Only the viewsonic pro models have a wonderful variable blue light filter you can change from 0 to 100. Many monitors now have only 1 setting which is just too much blue light reduction. Some have 4 settings which is better. I still returned it, and that’s when I found out what the darkness is on the outer 1.5″ of this LG panel,…. it’s somehow the mounting of the panel like it’s glued inside the panel. It showed up as I was boxing it back up with just the right light glare, and now I know why it has dark edges. Top and bottom too but I never saw those while the monitor was on, only left and right affected me.
—Acer XV272U KV : what I’m typing on now. I got this because of the wide gamut of color, high refresh rate, etc. Eye strain is a little more than most of the other panels and I get this strange effect on the panel like a 3D coating graininess that messes with my eyes. I’ve had this before on a laptop screen and sure enough it’s an innolux panel. great for outdoor brightness but horrible for indoor eye strain. The high refresh rates don’t seem to make a huge improvement as I found with the XG2705-2K, some but hardly noticeable. The colors are just amazing now seeing stuff I never saw before on a sRGB monitor. The ambient light meter has 3 settings but they appear to all be the same and too dim without a way to change it. The proximity sensor which dims the monitor when you leave works awesome! Only wish the light meter was as good. I’m returning this too because the text clarity is bad. I’m not sure what exactly you call it, but the pixel to the right of each letter appears to smear. I’ve tried all different settings under clear-type windows settings, many different monitor settings, and can’t find anything that makes it sharp like the LG panel. I too photos and you can see it in the photos zoomed in.
So now what do I buy? I’m willing to try the AUO AHVA-IPS panels and wanted to up the price to the SW270C, until I saw the PWM. For IPS the Acer B277U / Acer CBL272U might be good, but little reviews on those. The M270DAN06.8 might be good in the ASUS XG27AQ but it has very slow responses at 60 Hz. Or one of the M270DAN08.8 or .9 panels might also be good. Very interested in the Acer ConceptD CP5 CP5271U, if it has a AUO panel and no PWM…… I don’t need high refresh rates, I’m convinced a 60Hz panel is fine for my eyes. Just no PWM at any frequency and not innolux panels. I’ve searched this site, which thank you so much I love it, as well as rtings and tftcentral trying to sort through my choices. I read the 8 page discussion on this forum but that really talked mostly about curved monitors which I was hoping to avoid buy may have to try one just to try a VA panel. Are there any 1800R or greater VA panels I should try? Or do I pay over $100 shipping to get a AOC Gaming Q27G2U here in the state? Will it have pinkish reds like some reviewers mention?
I really don’t want to buy a hardware color calibrator. I’m not that hard core where I want to maintain those accuracy values, but I want something that has good factory color calibration for my photo editing. And I want something easy on my eyes, that’s why I’m going through so many monitors. Do you have any suggestions?
PCM2Hi brownc,
I have a few observations.
– You would ideally have a specific gamut in mind and work with it if you’re wanting accurate colour output for photo editing. That could be DCI-P3, it could be Adobe RGB. What do you end up doing with the photos you edit? You should certainly consider a colorimeter or similar device which will greatly aid accuracy. It doesn’t matter if a monitor is perfectly calibrated from the factory, things shift over time. Even if it just helps you adjust colour channels or other basic OSD settings, it could be worthwhile. I appreciate it’s an extra expense and you aren’t seeking absolute perfection. But some of the models you’re considering have more than a colorimeter’s difference in price between them anyway. If you’re using a visual reference and your photos are for your own enjoyment or consumption or absolute colour accuracy isn’t essential, that’s fine. And I think it appears that’s the case here – you just want enough extension in the gamut for some extra saturation to be captured that you were seeing in real life when taking the photo. And calibration that’s good enough so things don’t look completely ‘off’ (dodgy gamma and colour channel imbalances could cause this, for example).
– The BenQ SW270C review by PRAD (you linked to this in a different format) does indeed show that PWM is used, in the high kHz range. That’s a very high frequency that doesn’t cause issues for most people. It’s the same regulation method used on the PA278QV and PA278CV and I cover this in the review of the former. That model was specifically certified as ‘flicker-free’ by TÜV Rheinland, because it essentially is for most people and doesn’t cause issues for them that lower frequency PWM might. I’ve received a lot of feedback from people very happy about those models in terms of viewing comfort, but everybody’s eyes are indeed different. The SW270C isn’t marketed as flicker-free by BenQ (it was initially) but that’s because they are strictly DC dimming only when they market monitors as flicker-free.
– The SW270C offers excellent Adobe RGB coverage and tight factory calibration for that colour space. Even though most would be fine with the high frequency PWM, you did state you found it problematic on the PA248QV. Your observations at reduced brightness suggest it probably was this causing you issues, so you’re right to avoid that route. And also right that you don’t need to be consciously aware of the flickering for it to have physiological effects. The SW271C is its successor, it also lacks flicker-free marketing and you can see there’s a huge increase in price involved.
– I wouldn’t discount all Innolux panels of all types based on what you saw on one monitor (and laptop). I haven’t used the XV272U KV myself, but your observations are interesting. Quite ironic that you find a monitor specifically marketed as ‘Eye Safe’ to be the least comfortable. But this goes to show how subjective viewing comfort really is. It sounds to me like you’re describing what I’d call a ‘layered’ appearance in front of the image from a matte screen surface that’s less ‘light’ than you’d like. Screen surfaces are complex 3D structures and they are very different for different Innolux panels. The XG2705-2K has an Innolux panel as well and you seemed to get on fine with the screen surface and text representation there? Maybe there’s something else going on as well, such as some issues with the sharpness algorithm on the Acer. You said you could see these issues in photos you took, would you be able to share these photos?
– The XG2705-2K seemed to work for you in many respects, but you weren’t impressed by its calibration it seems. That varies between units and again a colorimeter help out there and could make sense if the monitor is otherwise good for your uses and well-priced. Perhaps consider the BenQ EX2780Q as an alternative, unless you feel the aesthetics and ergonomics are deal-breakers. Then again there are certainly no guarantees with the calibration there either, it’s usually decent for the native gamut (DCI-P3-ish) but a colorimeter could again help.
– The ASUS XG27AQ performs perfectly well at 60Hz, not sure what gave you the idea it has ‘very slow responses at 60Hz’. And that could well be one to try – I usually find AUO’s screen surfaces quite agreeable and on the ‘light’ and unlayered side. Don’t fall into the trap of comparing pixel response times on RTINGS at max refresh and 60Hz and then seeing the values are much higher at 60Hz and are therefore ‘slow’. A different (slower) pixel overdrive setting is usually used at 60Hz vs. much higher refresh rates. That is intentional as the pixel response requirements for optimal performance are much lower at 60Hz. You want to turn down the overdrive to minimise overshoot. There’s no point in using strong pixel overdrive that may work fine at higher refresh rates if it just gives you a lot of overshoot without any perceived blur advantage at 60Hz.
– Not sure what model you’re referring to with Dell 2521D?
– The Acer CP5271U V does indeed have a flicker-free AUO panel. Basically the 27″ version of the XB323U GP‘s panel. And I’ve received some really good positive feedback about that model. It offers a strong factory calibration, which I know is appealing to you, and achieves the promised 99% Adobe RGB colour gamut. It is a really feature-packed monitor for the price. Its HDR capability and hardware calibration sets it apart from quite a few others, but even if you’re just interested in its ‘raw performance’ as you are then it ticks quite a few boxes.
– You shouldn’t go down the VA route for colour accuracy, the colour consistency simply isn’t there. Especially on larger screens. In our reviews this concept is explained and explored with specific examples. Plus the panel types article where it’s summarised. Furthermore, you seem quite sensitive to screen surface and possibly subpixel-related intricacies. VA models can be a bit problematic with this in mind and whilst most people will find them just fine in that respect, based on the experiences you’ve shared I suspect you might not.
– Please don’t use the term ‘2K’ to describe the 2560 x 1440 (WQHD or 1440p) resolution as it’s inaccurate and misleading. I don’t blame you for doing this and I point this out to anybody who uses the term. Including manufacturers like ViewSonic who shove it in their model codes, which doesn’t help matters. So it’s nothing personal. 🙂
browncThanks so much for the quick reply! Yes a colorimeter may be in my future once I get into the photo correcting stages, so I’m not entirely against it. Just want to wait until I really need one before spending money on something that later becomes an old model with something better available at the same cost. However, my old Soyo 24″ VA monitor needs replacement as the work I do is better with 1440 resolution. And eye strain is getting more important as I work late at night and my age is getting up there. Originally I thought sRGB would be fine but after seeing adobe RGB that just blew me away. So for right now it’s just my eye with other monitors and prints I am pretty good at colors.
– Ergonomics aren’t important as long as it has a VESA mount then I can use my own arm for that.
– I’m surprised that companies don’t do DC dimming, especially when people like me do get affected by the high frequency PWM. I was hoping for a $400 monitor, but you see when I considered the SW270c that I’m willing to go more if the monitor is worth it to me.
– I really was hoping the XV272U KV would work out great for me. Amazon had it at $430 which is $30 more than the original suggested price and the XV272U is at $300 so that became hard to justify the added expense for the KV model but the potential benefits were worth taking the risk. It wasn’t the least comfortable, the least comfortable are the ones with PWM that I’ve sat in front of. When I work late at night, my office is maybe 60% brightness on the lights, so I dim my monitor accordingly. After 2 hours that’s a lot of time and my eyes strain with PWM monitors noticeably, let’s rate that a 8 out of 10. The non PWM monitors like XV272U KV seem to top out at 5 out of 10, while some like the VP2768a or p27h-20 were a 2 out of 10. After comparing the Innolux to the LG panel, both visually and based on eye strain, I can only imagine the panel type may play a role. Note for the last 20 years I’ve been on a VA panel and only brightness could cause eye strain for me. Not sure if PLS is better, but the Innolux was for sure different than the LG in harshness to the eyes with bright colors like white. I’d almost consider going glossy if it’s the coating but I think it’s both the panel too.
– Interesting on the XG2705-2K because I would rate that at a 4 out of 10. It was better than the XV272U KV but no where close to the LG. The XG2705-2K didn’t have the sharpness issue the XV272U KV did but it still sparkled somehow more than the LG panel. Yes I will post links to the picture comparisons between the XV272U KV and the LG panel.
– I did also try another monitor, the BenQ 2700PT, bought renewed off Amazon and it came missing the arm for the mount. I did try it out for a week then sent it back. The panel seemed good maybe 3 out of 10 on eye strain, but the software and DDC/CI and other features seemed a little buggy and in the end it didn’t have more than sRGB colors. I looked at the EX2780Q when I was worried the refresh rate may have been causing the strain, but at that point I saw the Viewsonic’s newer XG2705-2K and tried that instead. The EX2780Q didn’t have the color calibration out of the box I was wanting and wasn’t as good for horizontal angle and other ratings compared to the ASUS ROG Strix XG27AQ which would have been my next monitor if the 60 Hz input lag wasn’t so high. That seemed out of the ordinary especially comparing to competing monitors. I know there will be times I need to be at 60 Hz depending on cables and whatever docks are available to me.
“I usually find AUO’s screen surfaces quite agreeable and on the ‘light’ and unlayered side. Don’t fall into the trap of comparing pixel response times on RTINGS at max refresh and 60Hz and then seeing the values are much higher at 60Hz and are therefore ‘slow’.”
That’s all good to hear. Just worried I may notice it at some point later if for some strange reason I game at 60 Hz lol
“Not sure what model you’re referring to with Dell 2521D?” meant to say Dell U2520D.
“Please don’t use the term ‘2K’ to describe the 2560 x 1440”
Yes very true, sorry!If the Acer CP5271U V were available now I would buy one. The ASUS XG27AQ would be the next best choice? But the dream of a VA panel will still exist because they are just so much easier on my eyes. Are there any 27″ VA flat panels besides the Q27G2U worth considering? Yes color isn’t as great I get all that. But for working late at night maybe I need a VA panel and buy another one later when I get series about photo work and go IPS at that stage with a colorimeter. The $1000 HP and NEC 1500:1 monitors are interesting, but seems like you can spend way too much time mapping and color checking monitors that I simply don’t want the hassle of doing.
Here’s pictures of the XV272U KV where you can see some dark bleeding over into the next pixels to the right. And on the p27h-20 there is none of that First is a bad example, second is the best example I could get from different settings, still some on the right:
XV272U KV example
p27H-20 exampleIs there another setting I’ve missed and not tried? Also tried different cables.
P.S. I also want to clear up the eye strain I speak of happens after only about 10-15 minutes, not after hours of use.
PCM2I appreciate the clarifications, that all makes sense to me. I was only able to get your ‘example 1’ photo showing the issue on the XV272U KV to load. The others returned a 404 error (links included in your post with strikethroughs). It is a bit tricky to see from the example, but it does look like what you’ve captured is, broadly speaking, a ‘fringing’ issue. Yes the screen surface may be playing a role but I agree there’s something with the text rendering outside of that which you’re not getting on with. I know from experience it’s very tricky to accurately capture this sort of thing on text. But I can see the displacement you’re talking about – would still be nice to see the other images and perhaps the 2nd example which you said was a better one.
This ‘fringing’ may be caused by the panel, Acer’s sharpness algorithm or a combination of those things. If you’ve run through ClearType and also ensured your colour signal is correct in Nvidia Control Panel (it should be given this is a WQHD model, but double check just in case). I don’t know what more you could do. Have you made sure ‘Super Sharpness’ is switched off? And does activating or deactivating the ‘Low Blue Light’ setting or changing refresh rate do anything to change this ‘fringing’? Probably not, but it might be worth checking.
I thought you must’ve meant the Dell U2520D, although I was thrown off when you said “It too was only sRGB”. It offers a 95% DCI-P3 colour gamut, similar to some of the other models you’ve tried. You probably had it set to the ‘Standard’ preset, which usually includes emulation of the sRGB colour space. But set to other presets, including ‘Custom Color’ it would be using the full gamut. Not that this matters given you didn’t get on with the size and resolution combination. And given everything that has been covered here I do think it’s pointing towards the ASUS XG27AQ as the best candidate, overall. I’m afraid there aren’t any flat VA models I could recommend, they’re few and far between and there are too many potential pitfalls which most users or reviewers wouldn’t uncover.
browncI was able to fix the p27H-20 example 1 link where you can see no fringing. The super sharpness does seem to help but it’s not a huge difference. The low blue light was turned off. Refresh rates and cables didn’t make a difference.
Yes the Dell U2520D does exactly as you said, on standard it’s more of a sRGB but there is a DCI-P3 which I haven’t found to be as nice looking as adobeRGB or custom color. I guess I should wait for the Acer CP5271U V.
browncWhat do you think about the Dell U3017 model? There aren’t too many reviews except for tomshardware that I found and your short summary. Do you have any info on the panel manufacturer or model number, you mentioned it’s likely a LG panel? That would be my ideal size as the 27 is a tad small and the 32 a tad large in terms of pixel size. I have work software that can’t scale so 4k monitor would require me to use 1080p resolution. There seems to be lots of good 4k monitors in any size to choose from but not so many QHD sizes.
PCM2It has been a long time since I’ve even thought about that model and I didn’t ever receive a great deal of feedback on it. Really it’s very much like a larger, slightly higher resolution 16:10 version of the UP2716D we reviewed. It uses similar backlighting technology and offers good colour performance without any particular text clarity issues that I’m aware of. And seems to offer a decent factory calibration and useful presets, much like the UP2716D. I’m not sure what the responsiveness is like, although checking an old email I had about the U3017 it was deemed ‘acceptable for light gaming’ by the individual giving me feedback. I’m afraid I don’t have any feedback on things like the screen surface, which I found very pleasant on the UP2716D. Hopefully it’s similar.
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