[EsaT]

Wouldn’t give Eve much credibility in getting products out.
But they have interesting article about visit to actual engineering aspect oriented Display Week show.

While micro-LED would have major strengths in high brightness and long life of inorganic LEDs, but manufacturing even small low resolution panels is very hard.
Basically we can hope to have displays available at best in five years.

Also reason why LG hasn’t been pushing for monitor size OLEDs is apparently that they have problems in scaling to small pixel size.
I wonder if those are also behind Samsung not making 4K QD-OLED monitor. Which would have been excellent way to give mid finger to LG and grab high end users.

https://dough.community/t/exciting-monitor-trends-and-panels-found-at-display-week/35236

[PCM2]

Good article (and thread idea). The overall pace of progress for OLED has been painfully slow – in fact it was around a decade ago I first drafted that very article on the topic (nostalgia trip). It always felt like a breakthrough was just around the corner, but it stubbornly remained a technology which on the mainstream monitor side was perpetually ‘a few years away’. With Samsung now pivoting completely away from LCDs towards QD-OLED, I really feel they could gain some momentum here and should be more aggressive with the panel sizes and resolutions offered. Maybe they will be or want to be in the near future, but there may indeed be some technical hurdles preventing that.

Micro LED is certainly very exciting and I expect it would provide a literally dazzling and extremely dynamic HDR experience, whilst naturally being very nice to use for SDR as well. It always struck me as something that was on the distant horizon given the cost and scaling issues associated with it. To hear it could be 5 years away doesn’t surprise me, though I obviously would love to see it in some form sooner than that. I’m also very interested in the ‘ultimate’ Quantum Dot goal Nanosys has in mind of QDEL (Quantum Dot Electroluminescent) or what they now refer to as ‘NanoLED’. A ‘pure’ QD solution which would include self-emissive red, green and blue QDs. But at this point it’s still a distant blip on a roadmap – it’s very early in the development cycle. It was specifically mentioned at Display Week 2021 but not 2022 as there would be no specific progress to report on.

[EsaT]

Before whole OLED hype there was actually SED, which was basically CRT like, but in flat form factor.
It was even demoed in CES 2006.
But then Texan patent trolls halted its development and once that was over economical downturn made sure R&D budgets were axed.
After that everything was OLED this and that hype.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-conduction_electron-emitter_display

Hopefully at least QD-OLED would mature soon.
Though use of same OLED as “energy”/light source for quantum dots might cause similar issues to OLED in size scaling.
Maybe electroluminescent quantum dots would scale better in size.
Hopefully those and Micro LEDs fare better in maturing than OLED.

As for size scaling it apparently isn’t any problem at low luminance, because tiny OLED displays are used in cameras viewfinders.
For example OM System/Olympus OM-1 has 5.76 million dot OLED viewfinder.

[EsaT]

Looks like original link has gone “out of business”.
As far as I can remember this is the same article:
https://dough.community/t/exciting-monitor-trends-and-panels-found-at-display-week/35236

[PCM2]

Ah yes, good old Eve to Dough re-branding. Certainly looks to be the same article to me, so I’ll update the original link.

[EsaT]

Nothing like changing name to inspire confidence for filling product promises…
Maybe name should be said like how it’s said in the Simpsons 😉
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnaeIAEp2pU

I think we can be pretty sure they aren’t going to be among the first to do actual mass shipping of OLED/QD-OLED monitors out to users.
Are they even shipping any of those monitors promised was it two years ago?

[PCM2]

Haha. I actually watched the entire 4m 24s of that video. Seems about right. 😀

[EsaT]

Considering this covers some of same techs, it would be good fit here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Monitors/comments/wzggzu/display_technology_advancements_for_the_next/

LG and others are working on various technologies to increase maximum brightness of blue OLEDs.
Which is good because it increases life time at certain fixed brightness.
That would also slow down appearance of burn in from uneven wear of pixels.

But it’s different question if any of those techs can be made to actually work outside lab.
OLED has been promised to come soon since decade ago and no matter the promises, it is still MIA.

As for Samsung’s QD-OLED tech, it uses inkjet style printing for quantum dot colour converters.
https://www.printedelectronicsnow.com/contents/view_online-exclusives/2022-08-24/nanosys-is-making-progress-on-inkjet-printing-qd-displays/
That’s good news for flexibility of manufacturing compared to usual lithography etc. processes.
But fragility/limited life span of that hyped organic LED is still limiting factor for it and there are cases of still rather fast burn in with those Alienware QD-OLEDs.
So QD-OLED is far from Holy Grail of displays.

Hence instead of wasting lots of R&D on QD these enhancement filters etc, push should be for bringing electroluminescent mode quantum dots into use to replace whole “Fragile/Handle With Care” OLED.
That would also simplify construction of display panels lot.
And manufacturing should be possible by inkjet printing, instead of complex process needed by microLEDs.
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5bda189b96e76f2107b924c1/t/5c2d35bfc2241ba2496f8e4a/1546466753158/Nanosys+Roadmap.pdf

And while Samsung is moving towards starting microLED panel production soon, it’s going to be only for very large TVs…
With propably “optimistic” price toward 100k $ level.
https://biz-chosun-com.translate.goog/it-science/ict/2022/08/25/TVQP2LZBMBHOJN7NDEYYJIIVVA/?_x_tr_sl=ko&_x_tr_tl=en
That still leaves plenty of question marks on both how long it takes for prices to drop to only half crazy level.
And if production scales to PC monitor sizes and pixel pitch/size.

[PCM2]

Good additions to the thread and some very interesting background reading there. I too am sick of promise after promise in the world of OLED. Whilst I do like the introduction of more products in the OLED category, I certainly feel inorganic alternatives (QDs for all emissive elements of the display – e.g. Nanosys QDEL / ‘NanoLED’) makes a lot of sense longer term. In the meantime, I’d really like to see manufacturers who use OLED panels bolster the product with a reassuring ‘burn-in’ protection element to the warranty. Consumers are understandably apprehensive about the technology, which they can’t just treat like current LCDs – so I feel this is nice for peace of mind.

[EsaT]

And to think that even R&D of SED was basically buried to make room for this OLED SNAFU…
Sure hope OLED alternatives pick up pace fast.

“Old fashioned” inorganic LEDs are certainly tried and true tech.
But if individual microscopic LEDs have to be manufactured separately and then individually placed on base substrate, there’s going to be challenges in bringing costs down to consumer level.
Even if they’re developing automatic machines for checking panels and replacing non-working “pixels” to increase yields, that will take time per panel costing money.
And pixel pitch needed for monitors is going to make that still more challenging.
So really afraid microLED will end up like OLED and not coming to monitors until many years later.

Electroluminescent quantum dot LED panel manufacturing using printing would be far simpler.
And even if individual broken pixels can’t be replaced, manufacturing costs per panel are likely low enough to afford lower yields.
Also printing those colour converters for Samsung’s QD-OLED should work as good practise for fine tuning printing tech.

While waiting for true self emissive tech, at least they could move that quantum dot enhancement filter to front of LCD.
LCD’s viewing angle problems come from “looking light source through pipe with blinds on it”.

BTW, only four months more to go and my current monitor will be freaking NINE years old.
All because industry can’t get their fingers out of their butts to make monitor, which wouldn’t be downgrade in anything and in general would be up to current standards.

Though guess problem is more marketing having their fingers up the butt of consumers…
Out of LCDs only A-TW polarizer IPS should have gotten any significant R&D.
TN is just synonym for excrement after CRT’s image quality.
And VA has black crush still there even if Samsung has seemingly managed to minimize black smear.

[slurmsmckenzie]

I’m not sure if this is a good place for this but I have been thinking about the current state of display technologies recently for the first time in ~2 years. I used to have a Dell U2717D 27″ 1440p IPS monitor which I liked but was craving deeper blacks / better contrast and maybe more than 60Hz. I love many things about OLEDs (I now have an OLED TV) but 2 years ago there was not much really available at the 27″ size so I ended up going for a used Acer X27P from eBay (around £1k). I’ve enjoyed the 2160p and local-dimming experience a lot and have generally been happy with the upgrade, although fan noise is sometimes annoying and there are times when “blooming” is noticeable.

Back to the present day and now we have 27″ OLED monitors available to buy! And also they are 1/3rd the price of the premium IPS FALD monitors which I did not expect. Plus we have the 34″ QD-OLED options of course. So I’m kind of excited again and have been considering an upgrade. But….

I’m worried that I would miss 2160p if I go back to 1440p. I guess I should have kept the U2717D all along, then I wouldn’t know what I was missing with 2160p….!

So, I’ve been trying to find out if there is anything I’d prefer “coming soon” – for example a 27″ or 32″ 2160p OLED or QD-OLED monitor? I saw some commentary which implied that a 2160p 27″ OLED might happen in late 2025, but there was not much certainty. I saw some opinion on Reddit which implied that 27″ 2160p OLEDs are unlikely to be economically viable to manufacture, something relating to pixel density, I’ve no idea how true that is.

I’d also be very interested in an IPS screen with more dimming zones. My X27P has 384 zones and I’m aware there are 32″ options with 1152 zones (ASUS PG32UQX and ViewSonic XG321UG) although these are still very expensive and have some drawbacks. There is the new Acer X32 FP which only has 576 zones and I’ve been reading on these forums that the local dimming implementation isn’t great so I’m not sure whether that would really be an upgrade from my X27P.

I wonder if there are any 27″ 2160p IPS FALD screens with 1152 or more zones on the way in the near future?? I have read about the Innocn 27M2V but this doesn’t really look to be available in the UK and apparently has a few quality issues. Of course, if Acer / ASUS / ViewSonic were to release such a screen then I can imagine it would cost the best part of £3k also…

I know only I can answer the question about whether I upgrade now or wait, but I can only really decide this if I know what is likely to come in future – when and how much the cost likely is! Any thoughts much appreciated 🙂

[PCM2]

I feel that if you’re used to the ‘4K’ UHD experience and you enjoy that then yes, it’s difficult to downgrade in that respect. TFT Central has a useful article which covers upcoming developments that are under consideration or in the pipeline (they’re actually the original source of certain ‘speculation’ on other sites, which like to copy Simon’s work and indeed my own work without attribution). So whilst there aren’t concrete plans at the moment for ‘4K’ UHD OLED models aimed at gaming, I see this as something of an inevitability due to market demand for such products.

I’d also be surprised if we don’t see other models using the Innocn 27M2V’s panel or a similar dimming zone density. As a small Chinese manufacturer with close geographic ties to the panel manufacturers, a relatively simple distribution network and streamlined product range with less ‘bloat’ they’re just a bit ahead of the curve in that respect.

[slurmsmckenzie]

Thank you @ PCM2, I thought I had read that TFT Central article but I can now see that there is the potential date of Q3 2024 for a 31.5″ OLED with 4K which is interesting. Unfortunately 27″ 4K is only mentioned as being “under consideration” – think I’d prefer 27″ ideally but 32″ would still be good. Both 27″ and 32″ are mentioned in the QD-OLED section but no indication of when that I can see but at least they appear to be planned.

Sorry that people piggy-back on your and Simon’s work, I’ll keep this in mind in future when looking at other sites. Must be very frustrating considering how much time and effort you both spend.

Thought it might be the case re: 4K down to WQHD, ideally I’d try it out for a bit but I’m not someone who is comfortable ordering a new monitor, trying it and returning it if they don’t like it (maybe I’m too polite). I’ve read some comments on this forum suggesting the idea of two different screens for the different purposes (i.e. a 1440p OLED screen for gaming and content consumption and a 4K IPS for standard desktop / productivity work) and that does sound interesting to me. I like the idea of an OLED that I only use when I want / need to (to help reduce image retention worries) but the reality of such a physical setup might be a bit too complex.

Overall it does sound like waiting another 2 years or so might bring more options that would suit me better than a 27″ 1440p OLED right now…. although it is awfully tempting as I know there would be many good things about it as mentioned in your review! Pity the screen coating isn’t glossy like the QD-OLED though.

[EsaT]

Better read those advertised schedules with +/- year or two accuracy…
OLED coming in couple years hype was going already in 2013 when choosing my previous monitor.

Separate monitors for different uses would be certainly big mitigation for weaknesses of OLEDs.
But space requirement would be big.

PCM2, forum seems to be forgetting NOT being subscribed to threads and sending notifications even when having unsubscribed.
(which started after some issues was it month or two ago)

[PCM2]

Ah yes, it looks like it auto-subscribes when I moderate a post (add a link etc.) Have hopefully fixed it so you won’t be subscribed to things you don’t want to be subscribed to! 😀

[slurmsmckenzie]

Just bumping this again following the excellent OLED Monitor Panel Roadmap 2024/25 that Simon from TFTCentral posted on YouTube recently.

It was great to see that there are some “4K” 2160p WOLED and QD-OLED options coming in 2024, although unless I missed something I couldn’t see anything up to Q2 2025 relating to a 27″ 2160p option? It seems like there is more emphasis on increasing the refresh rate for the existing 1440p resolution on 27″, I can appreciate there may be many reasons for this – I’ve no idea how popular a 27″ “4K” OLED is compared to 32″ and indeed 27″ 1440p high refresh rate.

If there is little chance of me being able to buy a 27″ OLED “4K” monitor before 2026 then I might be tempted to get one of the current offerings in the meantime.

[PCM2]

~27″ ‘4K’ models tend to outsell their ~32″ counterparts mainly due to the lower price (if comparing apples to apples when it comes to panel type). There are manufacturing constraints with non-RGB OLED technology which makes it more difficult to apply to screens with a high pixel density, so that could explain the models on the roamap rather than LG Display and Samsung Display’s projected demand for certain size and resolution combinations.

[slurmsmckenzie]

Thanks PCM2, that makes sense – would QD-OLED be included in what you say about the pixel density?

Perhaps I should create a cardboard mock-up of a 32″ monitor and see if it would work on my desk after all, maybe if I wall-mount it… 🙂

[PCM2]

Yes – basically anything without a standard stripe layout for the subpixels (so both QD-OLED and WOLED). It could be worth getting crafty like that, with OLEDs potentially being quite slim you should be able to get it quite close to the wall as well.

[Author]

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